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How to handle returned capital from an investment or CD?

PatD

I have a large number of CDs and Treasuries. When a CD or Bond matures, the funds are returned to my Investment account plus interest. I can categorize the Interest Income correctly, but how do I characterize the capital return. It is defaulting to Personal Income but that screws up the income reports. Its not really income but rather return of capital that was previously invested.

New to Simplifi, I am coming form the Quicken Classic where I had the same issues but there it tracked my cost basis and seemed to correctly report the return of capital as $0 income.

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Accepted answers

Coach Jon

Hello @PatD,

Thanks for reaching out! At this time there is no option for Return of Capital transaction in Savings accounts. You can definitely try changing the account to an Investment account to see if that works for you, or you can ignore the Return of Capital transactions in the Savings account from the Spending Plan and Reports. https://support.simplifi.quicken.com/en/articles/3569626-how-to-exclude-transactions-from-reports-and-the-spending-plan

-Coach Jon

DannyB

@PatD

For the capital portion of your CD you could try changing the category from "Personal income" to "transfer" from the CD account and that will keep it from showing up as personal income. Transfers are by default excluded from the Spending Plan and Reports.

It looks like the Price per Share is what is throwing your numbers for this CD. It seems to me the Price per share should be $1.00 and not $100.7438 that is showing. You can edit the price per share via the 3-dot menu upper right side of the holding detail page or hover over the holding's listing on the Holdings page and click on the 3-dot menu that will appear at the right edge and select "Edit holding."

All comments

Coach Kristina

Hello @PatD,

To assist, please provide more detail. Is this an investment account that is connected and downloads from the financial institution, or is this an account that you track manually?

I can see when adding a manual transaction to an investment account, there is an option to select Return of Capital as the transaction type.

Does selecting that not work correctly for characterizing the CD or Bond maturation? If it's a connected account, how is the transaction downloading into Quicken Simplifi?

I look forward to your response!

PatD

Thank you for the quick reply.

The CDs and Bonds are all in Investment accounts and are connected and downloaded from Ally and Schwab bank accounts. When the transaction downloads it categorizes it as Personal Income automatically. I have not tried to do any manual entries so far.

I also notice that when I go into any of the CDs in the investment account to look at the details, it shows the correct value and number of shares but in the account view is 100 times what it should be. It correctly shows the value (in this example) as $10,074.38 but below it shows the value as $1,007438.00 and the gain incorrectly as $997,438.

PatD

I'm sorry. I just noticed that the Schwab CDs are in an investment account, but the Ally CDs are in a Savings account. SO in the investment account I can manually change to return of capital and that removes it from the Income reports as I woudl expect. I don't see that option for the Savings account. Is there a way to handle return of Capital in a savings account or do I need to change them to an Investment account?

Coach Jon

Hello @PatD,

-Coach Jon

DannyB

@PatD

PatD

I see no way to change the share value in the main investment account holdings page nor in the holdings detail page. There are no three dot handles to click and hovering over the per share price only gives me the same share price. I did not enter the share price so it must have downloaded it from my bank. Its weird that this same thing happened in 2 different banks (Schwab and Ally) and in 2 different account types (Investment and savings account). Even stranger that the total value for each CD shown in the account and dashboard pages are correct, its only when I go to the holdings page that I see the 100X increase in value of the holding.

Coach Jon

Hello @PatD,

Thanks for the follow-up. Is it just that singular holding that has an incorrect share price? How does the holding appear on your bank's website?

-Coach Jon

PatD

All CDs in both accounts look the same.

I do not see a "Share price" in Ally on their site Just the total value of the CD and the accumulated interest.

In Schwab the CD value is shown at the higher amount. In this case it shows it as $100.7348.

Coach Jon

Hello @PatD,

I believe screenshots would help here for clarification. Can you provide the following information when you are able? Feel free to redact any personal information.

The name of the account, as it appears in Quicken Simplifi.
The balance for the account in the Accounts List in Quicken Simplifi (this is the list of all accounts and balances on the left side of the Dashboard on the Quicken Simplifi Web App, or the list of all of your accounts when you select "Accounts" from the Quicken Simplifi Mobile App).
The balance for the account in the Investments Portfolio in Quicken Simplifi (if you have multiple investment accounts, you'll want to filter the page to just this account).
The balance for the account as displayed on the bank's website.
A screenshot of the holdings for the account in Quicken Simplifi (if you have multiple investment accounts, you'll want to filter the page to just this account).
A screenshot of the holdings on the bank's website for a comparison.

PatD

Name of the Schwab account is "Designated Beneficiary JT …736" The amount in account is $587,635.70.

The total in the Investment accounts, holdings view is $588,722.92. I can not account for the small difference.

The value in the Schwab Web site is $587,635.70

There are too many holdings to show them all on one page. I will just take the Cross River CD, first CD in the account to show the issue again:

In Simplifi it shows the Shares as 10,000, a share price of $100.7394 and the balance correctly as $10,073.94. See the above image.

In Schwab it also shows the Cross River CD correctly with a quantity of 10,000 and share price of $100.7394 and a value of $10,073.94.SO far so good.

But in Simplifi when I click on that holding to view its details I see this:

At the top it all seems fine. Correct value and correct gain. But the bottom line shows the same 10,000 shares at the same $100.7394 er share but it shows the value at $1,007,394.00 which is 100X too high. Obviously the gain of $997,394 is also incorrect.

Every CD in this and the other Schwab accounts I have shows the same. Every CD I hold in the Ally Savings account also does the same thing.

DannyB

Hi @PatD

I've been a bit fascinated with this thread. Other than what I tossed in earlier I have no idea of what is going on.

Still, I' curious why the "price per share" for these CDs is "$100.7394" and not "$1.007394".

It looks like Schwab is showing this "price per share" is also showing as "$100.7394" which is being downloaded into QS but Shwab appears to calculate the pps as $1.007394 giving the correct total cost of $10,000 and correct gain as $73.94. Whereas QS is using the $100.7394 as the multiplier and not converting that to $1.007394 the way Schwab appears to do.

Whatever else is going on this one thing is confusing for me.

PatD

I mistakenly said that the Ally CDs do the same. But the Ally CDs are set up as savings accounts and they do not have the same holdings view as the investment accounts. So they do not show a per share price anywhere.

It also does not appear that the holding view, incorrect "calculated" values are used in any of the reports etc that Simplifi creates nor does it seem to affect the account totals.

I seem to remember running into this with Quicken Classic at one time but I think I was able to change the number of shares so it worked out correctly there. No way I see to do that in Simplifi.

thanks for your help.

Coach Jon

Hello @PatD,

Thanks for the information. You can only add and edit Holdings in manual Investment Accounts; connected Investment Accounts do not allow this ability, as the information is downloaded directly from the financial institution. I would have you try resetting the account connection to see if it calculates correctly afterward, just to make sure. https://support.simplifi.quicken.com/en/articles/4857199-when-and-how-to-reset-your-account-connections

Let us know if that works out for you.

-Coach Jon